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XWing0949

X-Pro2: Raw+Jpeg, Can't delete both at the same time?!

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XWing0949

Hey, noticed something a little annoying about the X-Pro2 regarding deleting RAW + JPEG Files.

I have my dual card slot setup to be RAW/JPEG, meaning RAW gets recorded to Slot 1, JPEG gets recorded to Slot 2.

So, when I shoot RAW+JPEG, as I usually do, both RAW & JPEG get recorded corrected and into their respective slots, 1 & 2.

Now, when I go to playback the images I have taken and I see something I want to delete, I cannot delete both RAW & JPEG files at the same time?!.. unlike previous cameras where it will delete both files for you.

I'm usually set to review slot 1 with RAW file and I delete it.. but, the jpeg remains.. I have to actually switch to slot 2 and locate the same image and delete the jpeg like that.

one or two pics, provided they're not buried deep or scattered widely apart amongst a large number of photos you may have take, would still be a pain in the ass to delete both unwanted RAW & JPEG files.

Is there a work around this so the camera is intelligent enough to delete both RAW+JPEG files at the same time so I don't have to do double duty to clean up my sd cards?

If not, looks like this needs to be addressed for future firmware update ASAP!

Thanks in advance.

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farrell

I don't own an xpro2, but I think you will have to select the card to be formatted before you can execute a format.

If I am correct, that is for your own protection.

"Double duty" sounds like unjustifiable whining to me.

 

  

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veejaycee

What if the user wants the raw because the jpg is not quite good enough or wants jpg only because it's done a good job. I think you're asking for a mind-reading camera.

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artuk

What if the user wants the raw because the jpg is not quite good enough or wants jpg only because it's done a good job. I think you're asking for a mind-reading camera.

sounds correct to me too.

I assume if you configure the camera to save raw and jpeg on the same card, then when reviewing it deletes both?

if you configure the camera to save to dual cards, then you are asking for a backup. It seems quite logical if you delete an image on one card, it shouldn't delete an image on the second card - otherwise it undermines the purpose of dual card slots and back-ups, right?

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XWing0949

What if the user wants the raw because the jpg is not quite good enough or wants jpg only because it's done a good job. I think you're asking for a mind-reading camera.

Not really.. sure, you might want one or the other.. but, usually If I see it's a bad photo, I wouldn't want either and try to start culling the crap out of the mix so I have better photos to focus on.

There should at least be an option to ask you if you want to just delete the raw or just delete the jpeg or delete both.

For example, can't you imagine if you took like 200 photos and say you wanted to knock off maybe 75 of them and they were not sequential and scattered and spaced though out intermittently, that if you took the time to go through the slot 1 raw files, that trying to do the same and seek out the very same photos you just deleted off the slot 1 and having to do the whole process again in slot 2 just for the jpeg versions could be a potential big waste of time?  It's doubling the work and making you delete 150 photos instead of 75.

I'm not asking or suggesting the camera be a "mind reader"..quite the contrary, I want to tell the camera exactly what to do all the time or at least give me the option and ask me what I want to do instead of leaving me the daunting task of doubling my culling process... don't you think it might a be a good idea that there should at least be an option during the deleting process to ask you what you want to do? do you want to delete only the raw file or also the jpeg as well?, or somewhere in file management settings to decisively set to delete both raw and jpegs at the same time?

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XWing0949

sounds correct to me too.

I assume if you configure the camera to save raw and jpeg on the same card, then when reviewing it deletes both?

if you configure the camera to save to dual cards, then you are asking for a backup. It seems quite logical if you delete an image on one card, it shouldn't delete an image on the second card - otherwise it undermines the purpose of dual card slots and back-ups, right?

Yes, if saved raw+jpeg to same slot, it will delete both automatically.

Well, this is not the backup process like one of the settings where it will write raw+jpeg to slot 1 and the same raw+jpeg file to slot 2 simultaneously.  I think the same problem could be applied here as well... you will have to go into slot 2 (or which ever the other slot you were not on) and repeat the process.. Why would I want to even keep the backup of the image(s) I already know are no good? I mean if I'm busy on the job and snapping away, on my down time between shooting sessions, I quickly review what I've just taken and start deleting what I know was a clear miss and not a worthy keeper so when I process the good photos at home, it'll be that much less to download and be more efficient cause I've already "cut the fat".

So, no, I don't think it necessarily undermines the back-up process.

And in the case or splitting raw and jpeg between slot 1 & slot 2, sure, you could consider it a backup, but then again it's not necessarily a full backup as explained above where both raw+jpeg are both saved to slot 1 & slot 2.. that's X-Pro2's concept of backup setting for how to use the dual card slots.

I still think you should be allowed to preset how the camera deals with duplicate files and either definitively tell it to delete both raw & jpeg files together at the same time.. OR, ask me every time what I would like to do when I delete during the deletion confirmation page/pop-up.  I think having options here to expedite the editing process would be better.. personally for me, it leaves me with more work..

Yes, I could just write sequentially so it doesn't touch or write to slot 2 until slot 1 is full, this way I can delete both raw+jpeg at the same time as I'm wanting.. but, that negates the ability of having dual card slots to automatically back  up the images immediately.  Choice, I want choice to still do my backup AND delete both corresponding raw +Jpeg files at the same time so I don't have a lot of unwanted photos I have to waste time downloading and looking for and deleting later when I have time sooner to do them directly from the camera.

Edited by XWing0949

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veejaycee

Not really.. sure, you might want one or the other.. but, usually If I see it's a bad photo, I wouldn't want either and try to start culling the crap out of the mix so I have better photos to focus on.

There should at least be an option to ask you if you want to just delete the raw or just delete the jpeg or delete both.

For example, can't you imagine if you took like 200 photos and say you wanted to knock off maybe 75 of them and they were not sequential and scattered and spaced though out intermittently, that if you took the time to go through the slot 1 raw files, that trying to do the same and seek out the very same photos you just deleted off the slot 1 and having to do the whole process again in slot 2 just for the jpeg versions could be a potential big waste of time?  It's doubling the work and making you delete 150 photos instead of 75.

I'm not asking or suggesting the camera be a "mind reader"..quite the contrary, I want to tell the camera exactly what to do all the time or at least give me the option and ask me what I want to do instead of leaving me the daunting task of doubling my culling process... don't you think it might a be a good idea that there should at least be an option during the deleting process to ask you what you want to do? do you want to delete only the raw file or also the jpeg as well?, or somewhere in file management settings to decisively set to delete both raw and jpegs at the same time?

"Not really.. sure, you might want one or the other.. but, usually If I see it's a bad photo, I wouldn't want either and try to start culling the crap out of the mix so I have better photos to focus on."

This is what I don't understand.

If that is how you work then why on earth are you shooting both raw and jpg in the first place? You can't have it both ways - the reason for shooting raw is to have more and greater opportunity to tweak files but if you are going to delete both when the image isn't immediately up to standard why bother to shoot both raw and jpg? You would surely shoot only jpg on both cards and save card space.

Personally I'd have to be a far worse photographer than I am to make mistakes so glaring (in any great number) that I'd be happy to decide their fate from the camera's LCD screen. That is something I do in my browser back home while viewing on a large screen when I can also decide whether to have both raw and jpg side by side for easy deletion of both or to view raw and jpgs in separate folders. It is much, much faster, more efficient and safer to delete on your PC/Mac than on your camera unless you are desperate to free up file space. If you use 2 cards of similar capacity you can delete the unwanted raws and you will have plenty of space on the jpg card without deleting.

I can't see that there is going to be any great saving in card storage for a half decent photographer and memory is so cheap these days that we can carry several cards per body.

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XWing0949

"Not really.. sure, you might want one or the other.. but, usually If I see it's a bad photo, I wouldn't want either and try to start culling the crap out of the mix so I have better photos to focus on."

This is what I don't understand.

If that is how you work then why on earth are you shooting both raw and jpg in the first place? You can't have it both ways - the reason for shooting raw is to have more and greater opportunity to tweak files but if you are going to delete both when the image isn't immediately up to standard why bother to shoot both raw and jpg? You would surely shoot only jpg on both cards and save card space.

Personally I'd have to be a far worse photographer than I am to make mistakes so glaring (in any great number) that I'd be happy to decide their fate from the camera's LCD screen. That is something I do in my browser back home while viewing on a large screen when I can also decide whether to have both raw and jpg side by side for easy deletion of both or to view raw and jpgs in separate folders. It is much, much faster, more efficient and safer to delete on your PC/Mac than on your camera unless you are desperate to free up file space. If you use 2 cards of similar capacity you can delete the unwanted raws and you will have plenty of space on the jpg card without deleting.

I can't see that there is going to be any great saving in card storage for a half decent photographer and memory is so cheap these days that we can carry several cards per body.

why can't I have it both ways?

Your reason and mine differ.

I want to shoot raw & jpeg so I have jpeg ready based on in camera settings.. but, if I don't like it and would like to tweak it another way, I still have a good working raw file to go back to and make changes later.  Why is that so difficult to comprehend?

I don't think you get it... if I am reviewing images and see something is obviously not in focus or somebody blinked or perhaps the shutter speed didn't freeze motion the way I wanted to, why would I want to keep both raw and jpegs if it's obviously a failed image?  what's the point in keeping one or the either if it's not even worth saving?  weird you can't see trashing the garbage of both raw and a processed jpeg of the same photo garbage wouldn't be something somebody would want to do?

Hey, I don't attack your methods, so you shouldn't talk crap and impose your almighty rights and wrongs on me either. I make no apologies for not meeting your standards of near 100% perfect shots every single time. Sorry if you never miss focus or can control when somebody blinks or looks off at the last minute.

It's not about saving memory space.. why are your assessments so shallow?  it's about taking the free time in between shoots to start the process of looking for keepers and getting rid of the garbage images.

And just what do you know about my shooting methods anyways and how my photo gigs work?  I've worked 8-12 hours days with clients back to back every half hour in a public outdoor environment. The perfect setup and controlled environment is not always there so I have to go with the flow and adapt and sometimes you just have to get what you can as much as you can so you have options and good stock of images for client to choose in the end. And, so there will be a number of shots, often duplicates that need sorting and dumping to condense to the perfect one.. and i have to turn around the photos within a day to the studio, so yes, time is precious and if I have the time to start condensing the best photos before I have to download later after my work day.. it's gonna need to be done sooner or later so why not sooner?.. and if that's the case, I would like the option to do so efficiently later.

and actually, I never shoot jpeg for clients or the studio as they always want raw, so this isn't even a real issue for my actual work...

going back to the the issue I personally have with the file deletion system, when I shoot for myself, I shoot both raw+jpeg.. I could just do back up setting and deal with 1 of the slots and delete all the images from slot 2 later if not needed.

But, I'm working on trying to shoot raw on 1 card and jpeg to another so I can easily access just the jpeg files to quickly send via wifi.. don't have to mess with raw conversions then sending photos, save an extra step. Sometimes, for example, the lighting isn't right, especially if you need to do a test shot using flash.. that's something more often than not should be trashed after you've made the shot with perfect flash to ambient light balance... again, why would I want to keep both files if I can just get rid of both right off the bat so I never have to deal with them again in raw and jpeg?

Nuff said, having a deletion option for 1 or both card slots would be much appreciated.

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veejaycee

What a thoroughly nasty response to a genuine reply. Nowhere have I said you should work in any particular way nor have I attacked your method or even described the way I work - I shoot only raw since I now only shoot for myself apart from a rare commission on my own terms.

They are not my reasons - I shoot only raw and would do the same if I used an XP2 and I don't delete in-camera.

These are your words - "Not really.. sure, you might want one or the other.. but, usually If I see it's a bad photo, I wouldn't want either and try to start culling the crap out of the mix so I have better photos to focus on."

Now make up your mind. Either you will delete both copies if they are not good or you won't and if you are going to delete both rather than rescue a raw why bother to shoot raw and jpg.

All I have done is point out and clear up the inconsistencies in your own argument.

This thread you began is about not being able to delete both copies of a file from 2 separate cards at once. Two of us have given responses as to why this might be. If those responses don't fit with what you desire that's OK but it gives you no right to behave like this to someone who has only treated you with respect and sought to assist since you joined this forum.

I shall not bother again.

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XWing0949

whatever.. i think you're confused.

I won't hold it against you.

The point is pretty clear.. can't delete raw & jpegs from both slots at the same time. I would like to, please (Fuji) allow an option to do this.

And I don't think my response was nasty.. If if it came across that way, it was a reflection of what came first towards me. I believe you initiated the verbal sh!t tossing by saying things like "Personally I'd have to be a far worse photographer than I am to make mistakes so glaring (in any great number) that I'd be happy to decide their fate from the camera's LCD screen." and "I can't see that there is going to be any great saving in card storage for a half decent photographer and memory is so cheap these days that we can carry several cards per body."

.. specifically in those two examples, phrasses like "far worse photographer" and "half decent photographer" in the context you put them in, came across to me that you were  suggesting I'm one or both of the two because of my methods.  Not cool.  And I still don't claim to be anywhere near a badass in photography. Even if I were to admit to being less of a photographer than you or anybody else, because I'm still learning and trying to develop myself and skills, I don't see the problem in me suggesting that Fuji provide me a way with deleting options to personally facilitate my current methods which make sorting and condensing my choice photos by allowing me options to more efficiently delete unwanted photo files.

Edited by XWing0949

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artuk

simple answer put all the files on 1 card, then you get exactly what you want. You don't seem to need second backups on second cards based on what you have described. Problem solved.

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Petrus

I have not ever deleted any shots from the cards, at least not since getting bigger than 256MB cards I started with 15 years ago. Why go through all that trouble squinting at the small camera display, when nowadays the cards can hold thousands of photos, and hard drives millions. So cheaply that it does not even pay to delete any photos anymore? Time wasted, with a possibility of a mistake.

My workflow: shoot only RAW. Transfer files to HDD, go through the catch with LightRoom marking those worth considering with one *, filter, adjust, export. All RAW files stay on HDD, when the disk gets full I just buy  a bigger (and, again, cheaper) one.

The whole problem is totally a non-issue.

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MrSteveVee
Hmmm fully understand your dilemma if you need to do image sifting out in the field and want the additional safety of separate cards for the raw and pegs, yes you have a problem, I had a quick look on the web and others are asking similar questions in the Nikon forums so "at a guess" this facility is not available from other manufacturers either.
 
I'm not finding excuses for Fuji but again at a guess the option is not available due to the complexity of the operation verses the needs of the few. If you think about it, to allow a delete of a Peg and a Raw and to also allow for a fast action, the cards would need to be indexed so that the processor could quickly find the associated image on either card to delete. If not indexed the processor would need to search through the second card to find the image based on (say) a file name association and that could be slow to boot with a lots of images on big cards.
 
Now Indexing would bring up all manner of potential issues during operations (think camera switched off/battery loss during index writing, card pulled out all the sort of things people might do inadvertently). Failures like this "could" start to cause complaints because indexes were corrupt and or miss aligned with images. Now the non indexed slow access search method "could" also bring up complaints because the operation was too slow and it takes years to delete an image etc. Think you see the picture
 
So I guess Fuji looked at the needs of the few and decided that it was not really worth all the hassle it would bring to give users this type of operation so it has been omitted. Pity as I can see the need for it in your situation.
 
Not a lot of help I know, but as you have already found out you will either need to do the hard manual delete or take a chance and use sequential and hope that a card does not fail.
 
As an after thought., years back I used to have a backup pocket drive that I could put a card into and store the data onto it when in the field. I could then format the card(s) and carry on shooting. Now  I don't know if such devices are still available but if so, maybe that is an option for your safety backup so that you could then use the sequential method of storage (and hence fast delete) safely 
 
Steve V    
 

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merosen

I don't delete anything on a card as a general rule.  The JPEG on the camera monitor may look crappy, but many times when I get it on a larger monitor, it has possibilities and vice versa. It may look bad because of the small monitor. Card space is plentiful and keeps getting cheaper. If your using 2 cards you have twice the space any way.

 

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